<div dir="ltr"><div>I would support having a separate type for communications towers (and another for fortification towers if required.). Skyscrapers are already covered. Anyone searching for towers could run a query pulling those 3 types together.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Would it be better if we rename 'tower' as 'communication tower'? (and add relevant properties, e.g. number of antennae, broadcast spectrum etc..).</div><div><br></div><div>A rough definition when used in structural engineering: the difference between a tower and normal structure depends on the how dynamic the building is. i.e. how much it moves with the wind, earthquakes etc.. This defines the difference between <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/great_pyramid_of_giza">The Great Pyramid of Giza</a> (138m tall, not a tower) and the <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/montjuic_communications_tower">Montjuic communications tower</a> (136 m tall and a tower). Dynamic properties of a building are calculated using the height as one of many factors.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Iain</div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 8:54 PM, brendan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:brendan@metaweb.com">brendan@metaweb.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
<div style="word-wrap:break-word">Tim, <div><br></div><div>I created the type a long time ago, so my intuition about towers mirrored yours. But I've been convinced otherwise. I agree with Iain on the criteria for creating a new type. The wikipedia article "Tower" opens with:</div>
<div><br></div><div>"<span style="font-family:-webkit-sans-serif;font-size:13px;line-height:19px"><b>Towers</b> are tall human-made <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structure" title="Structure" style="text-decoration:none;color:rgb(0, 43, 184);background-repeat:initial;background-color:initial" target="_blank">structures</a> that are almost always taller than they are wide, usually by a significant <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Margin" title="Margin" style="text-decoration:none;color:rgb(0, 43, 184);background-repeat:initial;background-color:initial" target="_blank">margin"</a></span></div>
<div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px"><br></span></font></div><div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px">dictionary definitions don't go much further...</span></font></div>
<div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px"><br></span></font></div><div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px">which doesn't inspire a lot of confidence as far as precise definitions go. So, to sum it up, "tower" seems like a specific something but I failed to find evidence that it actually is :) As ridiculous as they might sound. If a person searching freebase is really stuck on finding things that people call towers, they are better off just searching for "tower" in the name. I do, however, support addition of types for some of the specific things you mentioned.</span></font></div>
<div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px"><br></span></font></div><font color="#888888"><div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px">Brendan</span></font></div>
</font><div><div></div><div class="h5"><div><font face="-webkit-sans-serif" size="3"><span style="font-size:13px;line-height:19px"><br></span></font><div><div>On Jun 5, 2009, at 5:20 AM, Iain Sproat wrote:</div><br><blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">Tim,<div><br></div><div><a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/architecture/structure" target="_blank">Structure</a> is found in the <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/architecture" target="_blank">Architecture</a> commons, so is specific to architectural structures and is applicable to most things from <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/pontcysyllte_aqueduct" target="_blank">aqueducts</a> to <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/penguin_pool_london_zoo" target="_blank">zoos</a> (including <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/fernsehturm" target="_blank">broadcast towers</a> and <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/empire_state_building" target="_blank">skyscrapers</a>).</div>
<div><br></div><div>The main criteria for adding a new type is whether there are any properties in it that aren't covered anywhere else. e.g. Floor area property in the <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/architecture/building" target="_blank">building</a> type or span length in the <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/transportation/bridge" target="_blank">bridge</a> type. The tower type doesn't have any properties, which is a good indicator that the schema wasn't appropriate.</div>
<div><br></div><div>My first thought was to try and improve the type, but I couldn't think of a property that wasn't already covered by the structure type and was also appropriate to the wide range of purposes of towers, from <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/orchardton_tower" target="_blank">historical fortress towers</a>, to <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/sutro_tower" target="_blank">communication towers</a> and everything in between. But that's not to say there isn't a property! If anyone can think of a property relevant to the tower type, please reply to this discussion.</div>
<div><br></div><div>That said, there are properties appropriate for very specific types of structures which aren't already covered by existing types, e.g. number of microwave transmitters on a TV broadcast tower. If you want, you can create a new "Communication tower" type if you would like to model this. See the <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/en/creating_types_and_properties" target="_blank">help</a> page on creating schemas and feel free to submit a question here or on the <a href="http://www.freebase.com/help" target="_blank">discussion boards</a>.</div>
<div><br></div><div>If the type is deleted, you can still search for tall towers by using a <a href="http://www.freebase.com/view/user/sprocketonline/default_domain/views/structures_above_250m" target="_blank">view to select structures above 250m</a> in height, for example.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Iain (sprocketonline)</div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 3:45 AM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:tigre119@gmail.com" target="_blank">tigre119@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"> Hi brendan<br>i am tim<br>I disagree and think 'towers' is an important class of objects to keep.<br>In the sense that they are a distinct structure such as the Eiffel tower and now there are thousands of mobile phone towers and radio transmission towers as well as many tower type sky scrapers in modern cities. <br>
They are a class of objects in their own right in my view.<br>Why do you want to remove the class? <br>I am new I thought the more the merrier was the approach.<br>Structures is a very broad term, sentences, stories and thoughts have structures.<br>
Buildings is another term, however 'tower' means a type of building or construction.<br>Is it better to expand the tower class rather than remove it?<br><br>My freebase is about marsupials and i want to fine-tune it, in fact it needs to contain all available info about marsupials.<br>
How can I set my freebase so it gathers data automatically and can it index it for me itself after collecting data from round the web? <br>So that queries automatically gather and present the details about any species of marsupials and associated plants and animals, from a range of data bases such as Berkley Uni, Smithsonian inst., DBPedia and others.<br>
the data results are needed as a mash-up result from several sources, displayed as a form or a webpage.<div><div></div><div><br><br> <br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jun 5, 2009 at 9:22 AM, brendan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:brendan@metaweb.com" target="_blank">brendan@metaweb.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left:1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;padding-left:1ex">At Kirrily and sprocketonline's suggestion, I am going to remove this<br> type. It has no properties and is too vague a category of structure<br>
to merit it's own type. The structure type covers the important<br> properties. The 12 existing tower's will be de-typed manually (they<br> will still be structure's) Any objections?<br> <font color="#888888"><br>
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