[Data-modeling] Unfinished work / lost work

Wed Dec 31 18:36:17 UTC 2008

I think that there would only be a couple general categories of "cause of loss," like destruction by author, death of author (which really an unfinished work, not a lost one), loss by accident, and no copies extant. You might need something like "lost in litigation limbo" to cover situations like someone dying and their estate not releasing a work. If you try to get more specific than a a few general categories, then I think Faye's point is an important one, in that you begin to lose the structured data. More specific information can always be included in the description area.

p

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Prucher" <jeff at metaweb.com>
To: "Freebase data modeling mailing list" <data-modeling at freebase.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 31, 2008 10:28:05 AM GMT -08:00 US/Canada Pacific
Subject: Re: [Data-modeling] Unfinished work / lost work

A "cause of loss" type might work; more specific information can always be
included in the description. 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com 
> [mailto:data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com] On Behalf Of Faye Harris
> Sent: Tuesday, December 30, 2008 6:17 PM
> To: Freebase data modeling mailing list
> Subject: Re: [Data-modeling] Unfinished work / lost work
> 
> I think a "bucket type" model for "lost work" would be just 
> fine. Would like to see a property for "cause of loss", 
> although I'm not sure what the expected type should be.
> 
> If a new type were to be created (e.g. "lost work cause"), 
> it'd allow for queries like "find all works lost by fire". On 
> the other hand, if it were left as raw text, more specific 
> info (though less semantically
> parse-able) can be entered, e.g. "Lost on board the Titantic 
> when it sank", "Damaged beyond repair when recovered from 
> theft by Inspector Clouseau".
> 
> -- Faye
> 
> 
> Jeff Prucher wrote:
> > I've created the "unifinished work" type 
> > 
> (https://www.freebase.com/view/media_common/unfinished_work), 
> and left 
> > it as a bucket for now: I think the co-typing should be pretty 
> > self-explanatory, actually.  I would, however, like to find 
> a way to 
> > model attempts to complete these works. The model should be easy (a 
> > property on "unfinished work" called something like "completions by 
> > other hands"), but I'm not sure what to call the expected type.
> > "Completed unfinished work" would get the point accross, 
> although it 
> > sounds oxymoronic.
> >  
> > I also have a question about the proposed "lost work" type. 
> Should it 
> > just be a bucket, like "unfinished work", and expect that the 
> > instances will be co-typed appropriately?  If so, "Cardenio" would 
> > show up in the list of "works written" for Shakespeare, 
> rather than in 
> > some kind of "lost works" property. This might be fine, I 
> just wanted 
> > to raist the question.
> >  
> > Jeff
> >
> >     
> --------------------------------------------------------------
> ----------
> >     *From:* data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com
> >     [mailto:data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com] *On Behalf 
> Of *Ed Laurent
> >     *Sent:* Thursday, November 13, 2008 9:25 AM
> >     *To:* Freebase data modeling mailing list
> >     *Subject:* Re: [Data-modeling] Unfinished work / lost work
> >
> >     How about adding a text field to the bucket to store info
> >     associated with why the work was unfinished and/or why there is
> >     confusion over what kind of work should be co-typed 
> (e.g., Jeff's
> >     Fitzgerald example). That way we can assess how to better store
> >     that information after some unfinished works have been 
> entered and
> >     evaluated for commonalities. While it's good to develop 
> the schema
> >     when the ideas are fresh, this one may benefit from 
> some notes on
> >     how the type is used over time.
> >
> >     -Ed
> >
> >
> >     On Wed, Nov 12, 2008 at 12:36 PM, Jeff Prucher <jeff at metaweb.com
> >     <mailto:jeff at metaweb.com>> wrote:
> >
> >         Could be a candidate for the Media Common domain, 
> if it's just
> >         going to be a
> >         bucket. There are lots of unfinished musical works, as well.
> >          I assume that
> >         Unfinished Work would then also be typed with whatever
> >         relevant types (like
> >         Written Work) applied, so that you could see the creator,
> >         dates, subjects,
> >         etc. So would "The Last Tycoon" also be typed as a 
> Book, even
> >         though
> >         Fizgerald never published it as such, and may not otherwise
> >         have been long
> >         enough to even be a book?  I think that would work 
> for Raymond
> >         Chandler's
> >         unfinished novel "The Poodle Springs Story", so 
> that one could
> >         assert that
> >         Philip Marlowe was one of the characters. Otherwise, I don't
> >         see a way to
> >         make such an assertion.
> >
> >         Jeff
> >
> >         > -----Original Message-----
> >         > From: data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com
> >         <mailto:data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com>
> >         > [mailto:data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com
> >         <mailto:data-modeling-bounces at freebase.com>] On 
> Behalf Of Faye Li
> >         > Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 1:48 AM
> >         > To: data-modeling at freebase.com
> >         <mailto:data-modeling at freebase.com>
> >         > Subject: [Data-modeling] Unfinished work / lost work
> >         >
> >         > Hi,
> >         >
> >         > I'd like to have a "Unfinished Work" type in the 
> Book domain
> >         > for capturing unfinished written works. F. Scott 
> Fitzgerald's
> >         > "The Last Tycoon" is an example. It's more 
> interesting when
> >         > another author finishes the work -- something more common
> >         > with short stories. Other than that I can't think of any
> >         > other property this type would have.
> >         >
> >         > Along the same line I'd like to have a "Lost Work" type in
> >         > the Publishing domain to apply to written works that no
> >         > longer exist. An example here is Shakespeare's "Love's
> >         > Labour's Won", which is believed to be a sequel to "Love's
> >         > Labour's Lost".
> >         >
> >         > An equivalent type "Lost Artwork" seems to make 
> sense in the
> >         > Visual Art domain as well.
> >         >
> >         > Anyone else interested in these types? Are they 
> enough to be
> >         > types in the commons, or more suitable in bases?
> >         >
> >         > -- Faye
> >         > _______________________________________________
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